A concern about the Artist Rank

[TheGrimOfCrazy]

As we all know artist is a new design rank where you showcase your more organic sprite like builds instead of towers and building. It's a really great idea but there are problems I need to point out and problems with the way it's being rated so please read this post thoroughly and think about what I have said before making any of your comments. I don't want any jokes on here.

Let me first talk about Architect/Engineer ranks.
Architect/Engineer both earn world edit/lite sniper
for there miraculous builds that look nice and/or function properly.
Here is an example: http://www.mxpulse.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=796
A nice exterior and nice interior. A large organic styled build that not many of you could pull off. KeyboardMan deserved this rank.

Now many people have done great builds for architect/engineer and don't make it. This is because these are very hard ranks to get unlike the mere Apprentice.
Architect/Engineer gets you world edit. Pretty much world edit allows you to do more things at a quicker pace using the power of stack and copy and paste but do you really need this unless for giant 'buildings' or stacking and copying lines of redstone? Your answer is probably. no. If you answered no you are right. minecraft builds are better and more amazing if you hear it was done by handing, making walls with world edit is fine, copying is fine but using world edit just because is not.

So now your probably getting impatient. "What's wrong with artist then!?". Here's your answer.
Artist is apprentice but for more of the sprite styled builds. Not actual buildings, here is an example of an artist like build.

Now that you understand artist let's observe this picture and see if it really deserves Artist, take note this isn't a build from this server but from google images. The boots are a mere 10 blocks in width. Placing ten blocks or typing a command to place ten blocks. Just place the damn ten blocks. Part of the arm and legs are mirrored. Now your probably like, "well I guess this surely does deserve world edit". You are wrong. Heres how you mirror an object in world edit. Select two points. //copy //flip //paste. //paste is the hard procedure because you waste 20minutes trying to get it in the same place when since this is an artist build you could just place the blocks in a quick second. So obviously this build would not be given artist.
Now we go to a build by one of our users Hid101 a former Architect who applied for artist for a different color change. ignore why he applied for artist and act like he is a newbie. He got artist.
Here is his application:

It's organic... kinda. 3 words 2 signs a few circles and a blue background. Does this even top our google demonstration. Nope. Sure it's original in a sense but, it';s just words with a background.
Would you like to see how are newly awarded moderator obbidobbi rated this project? No? Yes? I'll show it to you anyway.

Alright then, going to try and rate this.

1. Uniqueness - 8 - I have yet to see this kind of pixelart, at least on Renegades
2. Likeness - 8 - The symbols look pretty much like the original Greek symbols, but for the rest, this isn't really applicable here.
3. Detail - 7 - I like the color difference in the omega, but the Alpha is missing some detail in it, also, some of the letters aren't on the same height.
4. Scale - 7 - This creation is fairly large, so I think a 7 is in place here.

Alright then, so 8 + 8 + 7 + 7 = 30. Congratulations. You have just earned Artist! However, as you are already Architect, you won't gain any new abilities, just the color will change. This also means you are the first Artist on the server!

Uniqness...8? sure it's partially original but 3 words that look unplanned and just lame barely any detail get's... 8. I would give it a 5.
Likeness: 8... Obbidobbi probably enjoys Greek but so what he managed to make the symbols atleast add something to them. They are plain and boring where probably anyone could make it with a bit of knowledge on the signs shape. It's a blue background some words and a circle. I like it as much as I like avocado, and you know what? I hate avocado. 4
Detail 7... There's barely any detail so what he added another blue on the bottom... There was no detail in the background or in the alpha. Obbi states that yet gives him a seven for replacing a few blocks with cyan. I give the detail a 2.
Scale.. 7 Okay this one I can kinda reason with but the real scale is smaller as the blue background is what adds onto it so yeah sure I'll give this a... 6
That adds up to 17. Sadly Hid you did not make artist in my rating. You can still have apprentice though.

So now we come to how we should fix this problem.
first we need real people who know how to rate. it used to be harder to get architect with only a few archs around. You know how many there are now? 20. 20 archs when we used to have like... 10. Some deserved it others did it. compare hids build to keyboardmans build and who do you think really needs the world edit? KeyboardMan. You could do Hid's build by hand in an hour. Hid said it was super easy to get too. Thus proving the standards are too low. There are people who could get it. Maybe like more 3D builds, less flat boring unappealing builds. At least choose good colors. Make something real not text.

My ideas:
Set the bar higher for artist builds and make sure you have people who know how to review builds review.
Smack down artist all together and make it an architect thing while making the bar super high where it needs to add up with normal arch builds.
make artist have the same permissions as apprentice but maybe like... the replace command from world edit.

Another concern, if Hid managed to get it with that couldn't some newb get it that easily and start griefing us. Look at crazyspazmans HALP thread. http://www.mxpulse.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=1075
We could have griefers like this who you can't check with logblock.

I hope you have taken the time to read this post. Thank you.

-TheGrimOfCrazy

[freakboy31]

I think it's good to pull the limits of WorldEdit for Artist and Engineer.

As likely, we might decrease the chances of others applying for Architect and rely on their trustworthiness and valid reason why do they need it.

[Gmoddude]

I agree with you on the apprentice part.

[TheGrimOfCrazy]

I think most of this is BULL SHIT. But I agree with you on the apprentice part.

I think it's good to pull the limits of WorldEdit for Artist and Engineer.
For the Director, if he builds well then there's WE for him but if not, okay.

As likely, we might decrease the chances of others applying for Architect and rely on their trustworthiness and valid reason why do they need it.

Both of you managed to not read the thread thoroughly like I asked.
What does director have to do with this and Engineer. Engineer is fine with world edit if you actually do redstone. Voxel Sniper we don't really need but it's still the same bar as architect and Engineer is suppose to be an option for the two. Freak you didn't state anything about artist. Thus making your your post invisible.

Gmoddude you failed to actually talk about it yet make completely stupid jokes like I asked not too. Proving you did not read it. Read don't skim or read the parts you want to or do not want to hear.

EDIT: That's better freak. Yet me an engineer uses voxel sniper and world edit a lot. the fun thing about engineer is stuff like making fun areas for players to interact in. Not making calculators. So we kinda use it. Jehova and me have both used voxel sniper in our builds. So I wouldn't count on it, but please read the thread this is about artist not engineer. I want people to discuss not make pointless posts just because.

[PandaOwnage]

In my opinion artist rank is whoever can copy off Google images the best, and that it really shouldn't be a rank, and if it has to it should be the same permission as apprentice. With the whole architect thing it really depends on peoples build style. You see, someone might build organically, and yeah, they look nice. Some other people build more box/square orientated, BUT they add a lot of detail to there builds, thus make the boxiness go away as the person would be attracted to the detail, but with the organic build people would be drawn to the shape of the build. Thus, it really depends on the persons build style, and what style you prefer rather than HERR DERR HIS BUILD IS BETTAR CUZ IT HAS CURVES!!! But I do agree that some people (I will not say who) merely, if not don't deserve architect in which they have. It really depends on who rates it, their ability to build and how they build, and what type of build they like. And nice post, you've got balls alright. But I've got the biggest balls of them all! I'll give you a Ricky if you get that reference.

[Gmoddude]

WHO TOUCHED MY POST

[Pri]

The artist rank is going to keep the abilities it has. But the rating system has been changed.

From now on, all rating submissions require three screenshots of the construction that is being submitted and I will be the one handing out ranks to players after I have viewed both the construction and the rating given by another staff member. If I deem the rating incorrect the user will not get the rank.

These changes are effective as of this post.